In this debrief episode, Jerome Deroy and Julienne Ryan revisit a powerful moment from Episode 142 with Gary Danoff:

“I’ve been laid off a number of times, and I used to have great shame about that. And now I have great pride and appreciation and acceptance of what it has taught me… Wealth can be measured in a lot of different ways… partly financial, and partly in wisdom and figuring things out.”

Inspired by Gary’s candor, Jerome and Julienne explore the transformative power of reframing difficult experiences—especially layoffs—as catalysts for personal and professional growth. They share personal stories that illustrate how setbacks often become the seeds of purpose, wisdom, and clarity in hindsight.

You’ll hear:

• Why origin stories rooted in adversity build credibility and trust
• How sharing pain points, when done intentionally, can support others
• Jerome’s own “bus of shame” layoff story—and the values it helped him uncover
• The underrated power of acknowledgment and appreciation in the workplace
• Why leaders should mine their past for stories that inspire and connect

Whether you're navigating a professional transition or supporting others through change, this episode offers insight—and a dose of gratitude—for the unexpected lessons along the way.

Narativ’s online course in partnership with New Mexico State University Global Campus:
Lead With Your Story (self-paced, on-demand course)
Podcast listeners get 25% off - Use code NARATIV → Register Here

Learn more about how to leverage Narativ’s storytelling method for your pitch and sales team: Download our free e-book, or you’re welcome to schedule a free 15-minute call with Jerome.
Please join our mailing list to stay updated on all our latest episodes and events.
EMAIL [email protected]
LINKEDIN https://www.linkedin.com/company/narativ-inc
TWITTER @narativ
Buy Julienne’s book here