Former DoD official Jerry McGinn, now Director of the Center for the Industrial Base at CSIS, joins Francis to unpack how the Department of Defense can better “separate the wheat from the chaff” in its innovation efforts. McGinn explains why authorities like the Defense Production Act (DPA) and Small Business Innovation Research (SBIR) program are vital to maintaining a competitive industrial base — and what challenges lie ahead after both programs expired at the end of FY2025.

McGinn discusses the delicate balance between encouraging experimentation and demanding accountability — highlighting that true innovation requires tolerance for failure. He explores why DoD still struggles to transition successful prototypes into production and how better data could help measure what’s working, without stifling creativity.

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