Best Radar Nerd Podcasts (2025)

1
How to Scale a Profitable Agency with 0 Employees (Using AI Agents) 1:05:48

1h ago1:05:48

1:05:48

Episode 714: Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) sits down with Matt Mazzeo ( https://x.com/Mazzeo ) about using AI agents as your go-to-market. — Show Notes: (0:00) Intro (3:30) AI as the Go-to-Market (8:50) The Billion Dollar Secret (12:03) Mario Kart Theory (18:55) Being a Tinkerer/Supabase (25:38) Amjad Masad/Replt (28: 41) Taste (36:44) Agen…

1
John Hiatt is Actually Not Scared to Talk about His Feelings (REISSUE), ep. 313 51:06

4m ago51:06

51:06

(Editor’s Note: Welcome to our Reissue series! For the next several weeks, Basic Folk is digging back into the archives and reposting some of our favorite episodes alongside new introductions commenting on what it’s like to listen back. Enjoy!) This episode featuring Cindy Howes interviewing John Hiatt originally posted on August 5, 2021. In 2021, …

1
How the Smartest Founders Are Quietly Winning with AI 1:18:43

3h ago1:18:43

1:18:43

Episode 713: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk to Jason Lemkin ( https://x.com/jasonlk ) about cloning yourself with AI and how ChatGPT will be the end of incumbent apps. — Show Notes: (0:00) AI body doubles Users tell AI things they won't tell humans (15:15) The incumbents are dying (27:25) Inside …

1
How to build a $1M+ startup using AI (Full Tutorial) 58:46

4d ago58:46

58:46

For the full experience, watch this episode on YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0j_n3OOM7c Episode 712: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) talks to Greg Isenberg ( https://x.com/gregisenberg ) talk about how to find a startup idea and build it in a couple hours using AI. — Show Notes: (0:00) Step 1: Find an idea (7:57) Step 2: Sketch ou…

1
Anaïs Mitchell: 2019 Pre-Broadway interview on Hadestown, Lamb Rearing, and Untangling Third Wave Feminism (REISSUE), ep. 312 51:22

5d ago51:22

51:22

(Editor’s Note: Welcome to our Reissue series! For the next several weeks, Basic Folk is digging back into the archives and reposting some of our favorite episodes alongside new introductions commenting on what it’s like to listen back. Enjoy!) Listening back, I feel like this 2018 interview with Anaïs Mitchell holds up. Originally published on Jan…

1
How I built a $3B AI Startup + 7 AI Business Ideas 1:17:40

6d ago1:17:40

1:17:40

Episode 711: Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talks to Guillermo Rauch ( https://x.com/rauchg ) about building Vercel plus 7 business ideas to start in AI. — Show Notes: (0:00) Dropout to job offer from Facebook (3:38) Genius vs accident (21:04) Building Vercel (25:26) AI startup ideas (31:38) IDEA: V0 for Video Games (33:09) IDEA: Doom CAPTCHA…

1
5 Startups That Looked Dumb—Until They Were Worth Billions 47:29

11d ago47:29

47:29

Episode 710: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk about how to evaluate risk and upside of new ideas. — Show Notes: (0:00) Bessemer's $140B misjudgment of Shopify (5:47) Shaan's Anti-portfolio (15:26) Goal: Avoid Ruin (21:30) Outlier personalities (24:51) Underestimating Uber (32:16) "You can't overinv…

1
Morgan Toney on Circles, Elders, and Phil Collins, ep. 311 1:00:58

12d ago1:00:58

1:00:58

Circles have played a huge role in fiddler and singer Morgan Toney's life thus far: from drum circles, to talking circles, to the Earth itself (a circle!). In our Basic Folk conversation, Morgan talks about his L'nu (also known as Mi'kmaq) heritage and growing up on what's now called Cape Breton, Nova Scotia, where his ancestors have lived since ti…

1
Hinge expert shares dating advice for ambitious nerds 1:17:42

13d ago1:17:42

1:17:42

Episode 709: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk to Logan Ury ( https://x.com/loganury ) about how young men can be more successful in dating. — Show Notes: (0:00) Intro (6:28) The secretary problem (14:43) What's happening with men right now (21:07) How to do the apps right (27:32) Meeting someone IR…

1
How Scott Galloway Turned $8M into $120M Through Investing 1:08:37

18d ago1:08:37

1:08:37

Want Scott Galloway's Business Playbook? Get it here: https://clickhubspot.com/pfg Episode 708: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk to Scott Galloway ( https://x.com/profgalloway ) about his wildest investments, plus advice for men in their 20s and 30s. — Show Notes: (0:00) FTX bankruptcy claims (Turn…

1
Kris Delmhorst: Inching Forward through Sleepless Nights, ep. 310 52:20

19d ago52:20

52:20

Kris Delmhorst is not a good sleeper. The Western Massachusetts songwriter is usually awake from 2 or 3 am to about 4 or 5am. Sometimes it feels nice and floaty, but other times she is wide awake worrying about anything her brain can get a hold of. This is similar to a feeling with which she ended her tenth record, 'Ghosts in the Garden,' with the …

1
How to retire with millions (and pay $0 taxes) 1:11:30

20d ago1:11:30

1:11:30

Episode 707: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk to Ankur Nagpal ( https://x.com/ankurnagpal ) about IRS loopholes that can help you grow your net worth plus Ankur shares 6 business ideas. See Ankur in person at the OOO SUMMIT on Friday, May 16th - https://lu.ma/2025 — Show Notes: (0:00) Ankur's portf…

1
$1M+/yr Local Businesses Hidden in Plain Sight 1:01:08

24d ago1:01:08

1:01:08

Episode 706: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk about offline businesses that are crushing it. — Show Notes: (0:00) Be a $1M dollar business spotter (4:56) Swim lessons franchise (6:34) AWS for the Amish (17:25) At home pet euthanasia service (25:37) Take out order call center (42:35) Cheat code: Coa…

1
Asking a Billionaire Investor How to Turn $10,000 into $1M ft. Mohnish Pabrai 1:21:35

25d ago1:21:35

1:21:35

Episode 705: Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) sits down with Mohnish Pabrai ( https://x.com/MohnishPabrai ) about how to turn $10K into $1M. Show Notes: (0:00) Simple = Genius (28:00) Never over-leverage (30:30) Risk vs uncertainty (33:00) Too hard pile (35:30) Be 1 inch wide, 1 mile deep (39:00) Learn from losers (43:30) A case for napping (48…

1
Sara Watkins on I'm With Her's Witchy AF New Record, ep. 309 54:09

26d ago54:09

54:09

Sara Watkins joins Basic Folk to talk about 'Wild and Clear and Blue,' the new album from I'm With Her, her band with Sarah Jarosz and Aoife O'Donovan. The new LP was inspired by looking back on your life in order to move forward, with a very witchy manner of speaking that encompasses the ancient, mysterious, and spiritual. Sara shares insights int…

1
I dropped out of high school…Now I’m building a $1T dollar company 1:12:23

27d ago1:12:23

1:12:23

Episode 704: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk to Blake Scholl ( https://x.com/bscholl ) about he went from high school dropout to Groupon to the founder of a supersonic jet startup. — Show Notes: (0:00) Find your red line (4:29) Problems hidden in plain sight (13:00) The making of Boom Supersonic (…

1
The Most Valuable Skill For Any Founder 59:43

29d ago59:43

59:43

Episode 703: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk to George Mack ( https://x.com/george__mack ) about high agency. — Links: • Steal Sam's guide to turn ChatGPT into your Executive Coach: https://clickhubspot.com/wec • High Agency - https://www.highagency.com/ • Nick Mowbray episode - https://www.youtub…

1
Brainstorming $10M+ business ideas with Jess Mah 1:04:41

1M ago1:04:41

1:04:41

Steal Jess' Billion-Dollar Startup Playbook [for free]: https://clickhubspot.com/jhm Episode 702: Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) boards the private jet of Jess Mah ( https://x.com/jessicamah ) to brainstorm business ideas and talk about her process for vetting which ideas to jump on. — Show Notes: (0:00) Buying a jet (5:37) Barn full of horse…

1
Mary Gauthier & Jaimee Harris on THE Three Shoes, Alchemy and Weeding out Baddies, ep. 308 57:54

1M ago57:54

57:54

Mary Gauthier and Jaimee Harris talk to Lizzie and Cindy for Basic Folk on-board the Cayamo cruise in front of a live audience. We get down to business in addressing NICE things by asking Mary what kind of shoes she's wearing – as she has a reputation for enjoying the good stuff, especially on her feet. After that, we asked and Jaimee Harris enthus…

1
How Nick Saban’s Side Hustle Might Make Him a Billionaire 55:27

1M ago55:27

55:27

Episode 701: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk about Nick Saban’s car dealership play, plus the most defensible ideas for AI startups. — Show Notes: (0:00) Car dealership billionaires (13:35) Local Maxima (17:07) Most defensible AI ideas right now 34:40) AI workflows for profitable newsletters (43:1…

1
5 under-the-radar trends (+ our business ideas) 51:55

1M ago51:55

51:55

Want to spot trends before they explode? Get the guide here: https://clickhubspot.com/wdv Episode 700: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) talks to Steph Smith ( https://x.com/stephsmithio ) about business trends that are currently untapped and ripe for opportunity to build businesses around. Use code "MFM" to get access to Steph's Internet Pipes…

1
Susan Werner on Defining Hard Work, Paid Vacations, and Relaxing as Indie Musician, ep. 307 46:29

1M ago46:29

46:29

The dynamic songwriter and multi-instrumentalist Susan Werner talks to us onboard the Cayamo cruise, which she describes as a "paid vacation." Reflecting on her upbringing on a working farm, Susan discusses the hard work that shaped her, but also how she’s learning to embrace rest and relaxation. With humor and insight, she navigates the balance be…

1
The Board Game Billionaire: From a $10k Kickstarter to $100M/Year Business 1:17:58

1M ago1:17:58

1:17:58

Want your own $100M side project? Get our guide to win your first 100 customers: https://clickhubspot.com/wfp Episode 699: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk to Elan Lee ( https://x.com/elanlee ) about growing Exploding Kittens from a $10K Kickstarter campaign to $100M dollar company. — Show Notes: (…

1
Anti-Business Billionaires: Lessons from Steve Jobs, James Dyson, and Yvon Chouinard 43:50

2M ago43:50

43:50

Episode 698: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) talks to David Senra ( https://x.com/FoundersPodcast ) about what qualities make an anti-business billionaire. — Show Notes: (0:00) High Level of Disagreeableness (9:02) Extreme Self-Confidence (12:55) Product Quality Obsessed (18:37) Retention of Total Control (27:28) Exit Strategy is Death — Link…

1
Jon Muq: Uganda, Cruise Ship Food and His Googly-Eyed Guitar, ep. 306 34:55

2M ago34:55

34:55

Originally from the village of Mutungo, Uganda (near the country's capital of Kampala), Jon Muq's journey to his current life of touring with an Austin, Texas home-base has been unconventional. Onboard the Cayamo cruise earlier this year, we talked to Jon about his childhood experiences, including fetching water with friends and "We Are the World,"…

1
From making $6/week selling worms to making $110M+ 1:39:26

2M ago1:39:26

1:39:26

Episode 697: Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) sits down with James Currier ( https://x.com/JamesCurrier ) to talk about going from $0 to $110M through network effects. — Show Notes: (0:00) $0 to $1.6B (4:23) Your life on network effects (8:00) Savage founders (13:40) Speed (15:49) The art of unlearning (21:23) Technology window curves (30:29) N…

1
Are tariffs good or bad for founders? 49:00

2M ago49:00

49:00

💰 Steal Shaan's [free] Episode 696: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk about what they’re doing about the tariffs. — Show Notes: (0:00) Intro (3:13) Tariffs (22:00) Medieval Times (27:48) Shaan's process for finding edges — Links: • Shaan's $20M Pitch Deck: https://clickhubspot.com/uve • Medieval Tim…

1
Ani DiFranco & Carsie Blanton: Menopause, The Wild Child, and Naps to fight Capitalism, ep. 305 43:44

2M ago43:44

43:44

Basic Folk is making trouble at sea with Ani DiFranco and Carsie Blanton! Hosts Lizzie and Cindy had the opportunity to speak with the two like-minded radical songwriters aboard the 2025 edition of Cayamo, a roots music cruise. Our conversation kicks off with Ani sharing her transformative experience performing as Persephone in the Broadway show 'H…

1
The Happiest Man in Atlantis (A Short Story) 15:42

2M ago15:42

15:42

💰 Steal Shaan's $20M Pitch Deck: Join Nick Huber and Shaan Puri for a free CEO Bootcamp on April 16th at 2pm EST: https://lu.ma/5kbwnk7v Episode 695: Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) tells the story of finding what is truly valuable. — Check Out Shaan's Stuff: • Shaan's weekly email - https://www.shaanpuri.com • Visit https://www.somewhere.com/…

1
"Ocean is the new space" - 7 Wild Ideas for the $3 Trillion Dollar Frontier 1:17:38

2M ago1:17:38

1:17:38

[free] Episode 694: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk to Will O’Brien ( https://x.com/willobri ) about how the ocean is the new hot girl. — Show Notes: (0:00) Ocean is the new space (8:50) Ocean surveying (10:25) Sea grass restoration (16:39) Defense drones (22:34) Underwater cable networks (31:51) …

1
The Step-by-Step Playbook We Used to Build a $100M+ Newsletter Business 1:14:28

2M ago1:14:28

1:14:28

[free] Episode 693: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) talks to Alex Lieberman ( https://x.com/businessbarista ) and Austin Rief ( https://x.com/austin_rief ) about how to build a profitable newsletter. — Show Notes: (0:00) Intro (3:12) 0 to 100K subscribers (9:18) Nontraditional hires (15:26) 100K to 1M subscribers (35:00) Entrepreneurs Operati…

1
Loudon Wainwright III: Oversharing, Family Ties, and Musical Legacy, ep. 304 46:20

2M ago46:20

46:20

The legendary Loudon Wainwright III, whose career has spanned over five decades, is known for his deeply personal songwriting and sharp wit – and oversharing. The patriarch of the Wainwright folk dynasty (which includes Rufus, Martha, their late mother Kate McGarrigle, as well as Lucy and her mother Suzzy Roche), Loudon reflects on the balance betw…

1
$100M founder predicts what will be big in 5 years 58:25

2M ago58:25

58:25

💰 Get the [free] Episode 692: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) talks to Justin Mares ( https://x.com/jwmares ) about what’s going to be big in the next 5 years. — Show Notes: (0:00) Intro (3:16) Longevity products for dogs (9:24) Toxin testing (19:55) Function and Superpower (26:19) Doctor for your home (37:25) Skin gut health (47:39) Natural …

1
7 Business Ideas from a Unicorn Founder 1:00:50

2M ago1:00:50

1:00:50

💰 Get the [free] Episode 691: Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talks to Immad Akhund ( https://x.com/immad ) about the businesses he would start if he wasn’t running a unicorn. — Show Notes: (0:00) Intro (2:17) IDEA: Lunar nuclear power plant (5:04) IDEA: Defense tech (10:09) The Peter Thiel test (13:52) IDEA: Selling stars (15:54) IDEA: Enterp…

1
Olivia Ellen Lloyd: West Virginia to Brooklyn, Finding Ground in Water, ep. 303 1:01:14

2M ago1:01:14

1:01:14

Olivia Ellen Lloyd's latest album, 'Do It Myself,' sees the West Virginia-born Brooklyn-based songwriter reflecting on the powerful imagery of water. She shares how it has been a source of grounding and calmness in her life, from childhood memories spent on the Potomac River to her current love for the ocean, these elements have shaped her artistic…

1
How a guy turned 3 YouTube Channels into $3 Billion Dollars 51:02

2M ago51:02

51:02

💰 Get the [free] Episode 690: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) tell the story of the smartest YouTube rollup they’ve ever seen. — Show Notes: (0:00) $3B of nursery rhymes rollup (21:55) Sam goes all-in on IRL (36:03) All-in dads (38:37) Shotsy (41:49) PEDs for business — Links: • CoCoMelon - https://www…

1
The Wildest Stories of Corporate Espionage We’ve Ever Heard 1:02:22

2M ago1:02:22

1:02:22

💰 Get the [free] Episode 689: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) break down the craziest stories of corporate espionage in history. — Show Notes: (0:00) Rippling vs Deel (10:21) The British East India Company (17:11) Oracle vs Microsoft (21:28) Coke vs. Pepsi (24:14) Uber vs. Waymo (26:03) U.S. Intellectu…

1
Bonnie "Prince" Billy On Making Nashville Musical Magic, ep. 302 1:04:32

3M ago1:04:32

1:04:32

Will Oldham, also known as Bonnie "Prince" Billy, has led an illustrious, sometimes mysterious career which has spanned decades and genres. Hailing from and still living in Louisville, KY, in our Basic Folk conversation Will reflects on his journey from a young artist struggling to find his place in the music world to a seasoned musician who embrac…

1
6 under-the-radar trends (+ our ideas) 1:07:09

3M ago1:07:09

1:07:09

💰 Get the [free] Episode 688: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk about 6 under-the-radar trends. — Show Notes: (0:00) Intro (2:24) Short Drama Apps (13:55) Rucking (22:10) Plastic-free everything (31:58) "Nervous System Work" (41:46) Biohacking plants (46:48) AI Social Networks — Links: • ReelShort -…

1
The high schooler making $20M a year 1:14:49

3M ago1:14:49

1:14:49

Episode 687: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk to Zach Yadegari ( https://x.com/zach_yadegari/ ), the high school kid who went from $0 - $20M in 10 months. — Show Notes: (0:00) Intro (3:45) $0 - $20M in 10 months (17:12) Sold first business for $100K at 16 (20:42) Zach's Influencer marketing playboo…

1
2 Trends Hidden in Plain Sight (+ $1M ideas) 55:54

3M ago55:54

55:54

Episode 686: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk about the two trends that could make you rich in the next 12 months. — Show Notes: (0:00) Trend: Fleamarkets (20:03) Trend: True Crime (26:05) Business ideas brainstorm (43:52) Fyre Festival update (48:27) Shaan's dad's travel hacks — Links: • Brimfield…

1
Rose Cousins & Edie Carey: Bast Friendship, Music, and the Art of Spatula-ing Life, ep. 301 1:25:31

3M ago1:25:31

1:25:31

Rose Cousins and Edie Carey's friendship has blossomed for over two decades. On the occasion of Rose releasing her new album, 'Conditions of Love - Vol 1,' the pair appear on Basic Folk to discuss the new music. They reflect on their early days and their first meeting as well as the ways they’ve influenced each other's careers and personal growth. …

1
5 Conversations that broke our frames this week 1:15:10

3M ago1:15:10

1:15:10

Episode 685: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk about the most interesting things they’ve found this week. — Show Notes: (0:00) Justin Caldbeck (8:02) Steve Houghton (20:15) James Currier (38:36) Furqan Rydhan — Links: • NFX - https://www.nfx.com/ • James Altucher - https://www.jamesaltucher.com/ • A…

1
How to win in ecom in 2025 (from a $200M/yr marketer) 1:07:49

3M ago1:07:49

1:07:49

Episode 684: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk to Sean Frank ( https://x.com/SeanEcom ) about his $200M ecom playbook. — Show Notes: (0:00) Sean's first million (8:35) $5M - $200M in 6 years (25:57) What people get wrong in ecom (30:33) Case study: HexClad (36:52) Fast-emerging trends (40:57) How to…

1
The Greatest Mind Hacks in Marketing History (Craig Clemens Interview) 52:03

3M ago52:03

52:03

Episode 683: Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) sits down with Craig Clemens ( https://x.com/craigclemens ) to talk about the greatest marketing lines in history. — Show Notes: (0:00) Intro (2:22) Does not contain an illegal sexual stimulant (9:09) 4-hour erection (10:56) Operators are standing by (15:17) They’re eating the cats (21:54) A diamond…

1
Sierra Hull: Mandolin Magic and Small Town Roots, ep. 300 1:06:40

3M ago1:06:40

1:06:40

When mandolinist Sierra Hull was little, her dad told her she was really good "for a ten year old." The older Hull knew Sierra had a fiery passion for the instrument and he knew exactly how to motivate his daughter. He went on to say that if she wanted to go to jams and porch-play for the rest of her life, she'd learned enough. He gave her realisti…

1
Basic Folk Presents: Folk Files: Shady Grove 25:27

3M ago25:27

25:27

Editor’s note: Basic Folk is pleased to introduce our listeners to one of our favorite podcasts by sharing an episode in our feed! Folk Files is a podcast hosted by Olivia Harding that seeks to uncover the mysteries of folk music through the ages and dive deep into the tangled history of murder ballads, sea shanties, rebel songs, and other music th…

1601
He launched a sweaty startup in high school. Now he'll be a millionaire by 18 1:12:45

3M ago1:12:45

1:12:45

Episode 682: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk to three high school founders about their biggest business problems. — Show Notes: (0:00) Intro (5:02) Sunshine Exteriors (29:16) Teens2Table (45:53) Totally Mums — Links: • Formidable Fellows - http://formidablefellowship.org/ • Sunshine Exteriors - ht…

1
I Made $50M Buying & Running Boring Businesses 1:01:23

3M ago1:01:23

1:01:23

Episode 681: Sam Parr ( https://x.com/theSamParr ) and Shaan Puri ( https://x.com/ShaanVP ) talk to Brent Beshore ( https://x.com/BrentBeshore ) about buying profitable businesses. — Show Notes: (0:00) $50K/yr to 9 figures (6:04) Accidentally buying a $1M business for $0 (11:06) Just In Time learning (14:11) Buying cash flow businesses (20:30) Priv…

1
Gary Louris talks to Mark Erelli on Songwriting, Late in Life Love, and Technology, ep. 299 1:01:02

3M ago1:01:02

1:01:02

You probably know Gary Louris as the leader of The Jayhawks – or as they refer to themselves, “a band from Minnesota.” The Jayhawks are pioneers of roots rock, alt-country, and Americana. Whatever you wanna call it, they’ve been making records where rock, pop, country, and other forms of American roots music overlap since the mid-1980s. But Louris’…

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